No perceptual positions is one of those ideas that I would tend to actually present to clients if they're
talking about perhaps an issue they've had or a relationship that the half that isn't working out if
they feel like someone's done them wrong or that they've been done an injustice or that they're the
victim or something like this.
What I find is that this is a great model to present to people on an intellectual level first and foremost
just to help them appreciate that there are in fact other perspectives out there in the world that differ
from their own.
All right.
So good to welcome back Karen.
And this is video and current I know we've had a few well I've had a few discussions with all the good
people at home.
One of them involving our marriage.
Yes.
Right so before we can get into this discussion I was wondering if you would be willing to share.
Right from your own experience how it is that your appreciation of perceptual positions on looking at
circumstances situations from other people's perspectives has helped you to become more relatable over
the last five to 10 years.
Absolutely.
And how specifically I specifically I think if I relate it to our marriage.
So I came into our marriage very much with blinkers on.
I stuck in my own perception.
But over the years being able to look at things from your perspective and has allowed me to see that
my perception is very much wrong at times and very inaccurate wrong or different or inaccurate or am
different maybe there would be the right word Yeah different.
And sometimes I use the word wrong because a lot of my perception might be based on my own insecurity
and my own doubts within myself about who I am which I might project onto the situation rather than
it being based on facts and the truth.
It's interesting you say that the way that I like to look at things I know we've had lots of conversations
about this in the past.
Sometimes it's quite easy to get into this habitual way of thinking that my perspective and the way
that I see things is right or wrong as life coaches we want to be looking look in a perception perspective
from a very different angle not so much what is right and what is wrong.
So very much a block away we're thinking isn't it but rather what is helpful and what is less helpful
because sometimes there are perspectives that we can look at life and situations from that are helpful
and sometimes that our perspectives that we can look at life and our circumstances situations from that
are just completely unhelpful.
Yes.
Yeah.
And sometimes if you're stuck in one perspective it it takes you ran around in circles as you focus
and that doesn't actually help me to work towards what you want.
Interesting.
Could you give an example an for example.
So there's been times in the past in our relationship where I might receive some feedback from you and
my natural tendency is to is to over analyze that and think oh my goodness.
Cain thinks the worst of me.
This is awful feedback and
he he's judging me here I think you know he's really unhappy with me and we're really actually and all
of all of this is going on inside of your head.
Yes.
We're really actually it's just feedback and it's just something to be improved upon.
But because my natural tendency is to focus on all this insecurity it causes chaos in my mind and my
life and rather than focusing what I actually want which is the connection with you.
And it takes me farther away from I actually want it.
My focus is usually on how thing it's interesting.
So you're it seems that you're your default mode has historically been fall into your own perspective
the way that you see things.
Because obviously it goes without saying that the way in which you see things must most certainly be
the way that things are.
All right.
Yeah.
So this is a default mode is a we as a kid like a part of a lifetime isn't it.
How has this ever been helpful for you.
How has this ever been helpful for never been helpful for me.
So what you're saying is I'm relying on your own perspective to be accurate and true that's completely
I was completely naive.
Yeah.
And actually it's really silly to us to assume that it is right even for a moment.
Why why why would you see that being true.
Because
it really is true.
My perspective especially when I'm jumping to the worst case conclusion worst possible outcomes and
so extreme thinking think that's not realistic at all as a block away thinking is kind of like right
and wrong thinking we've got to we've obviously got a Facebook group and one of the most frustrating
things I see in the Facebook group is when.
And you know perhaps like I might post a few questions or something like this and generally equate thought
provoking by nature and you'll have a whole lot of people actively engaged in the discussion it becomes
healthy people share in their perspectives and then someone comes along and just says no that's wrong
I disagree.
Everyone's entitled to their opinion and this is what I've found to be such a closed minded and also
closed hearted attitude to take towards life.
You're wrong I'm right my way of looking at things is right your way of looking at things is wrong.
This is certainly not an effective way of winning friends or influencing people.
I'm guessing when our goal is to connect with people and remain connected in a relatively meaningful
way our goal can't be to be right or be wrong.
Instead our goal must be to understand.
I need to understand your perspective.
We are to remain connected and you're going to be important that you understand my perspective if we
are going to remain connected so unless two people are fighting for a connection and an Internet into
an interaction or relationship then the relationship's pretty much doomed.
No it is going to be possible in a coaching relationship for your client to be choosing disconnection
whilst you continue to fight for connection.
And sometimes it is very much the case but that's the nature of the help and relationship to help our
clients appreciate new perspectives sometimes we might be the only member of the relationship fighting
for connection for weeks.
All right.
And it's not about this being right or wrong I'd be saying it's the process of the relationship if a
client has learned that people cannot be fundamentally be trusted in life then you're going to have
your work cut out.
Aaron this person's trust you're going to have to show them and prove to them consistently perhaps for
four weeks that you are worthwhile in Europe you're worthy of their trust.
All right.
So the only way that we really when people's trust in life is is by fighting to see things from other
people's perspective.
Mm hmm interesting to summarize that well fantastic.
So come on.
Could we have a conversation about times in the past that you're an unwillingness to consider other
people's perspectives has really cost you connection
Yeah.
Yeah absolutely.
Yeah.
I can think of a number of relationships where that's true on different levels.
Could you give a confidential example.
Yeah.
And a tick.
So a family member.
And who
I've known over the years I've I've assumed the worst of her intentions
and withdrawn from the relationship which has actually cost the connection over a number of years.
And so for example like oh
the relationship is confusing in some ways because the relationship has grown apart over the years and
this is because of because of
because because neither of us has had the honest conversation about about how we've both changed and
why the relationships grown apart.
And so it's kind of just gone.
It's got the gaps going farther and farther apart.
So I'm assuming you still love this person.
Yes it avoids come into the relationship and so love the love was there but the responsibility and the
honesty and the truth yet and protect in particular the truth.
The truth is the truth wasn't in the relationship.
So we can link this but the seven pillars of healthy healthy relationships.
Yes because all seven pillars need to be standing in order for the healthy relationship to sustain.
Yes.
Yeah.
So you've got the love.
You don't have the truth and without the truth.
You don't have to have the trust the trust the trust isn't there.
We don't know what we can trust each other for and
the honesty I think that's been the biggest part of both parties not being honest with each other about
and what we would like in their relationship and issues that have caused the relationship to not really
understand reach each other or at it's just them as you're talking here it seems that you're you're
conversing for a place in between first position and second position.
So you kind of talk in kind of on behalf of you and this other person.
If I can just simply say what I see.
So we're gonna get into the more of the practicalities of perceptual positions no.
Okay.
So you're talking on behalf of not just yourself but this other person.
Yes.
I'm kind of speaking generally for both of speaking generally on behalf of both of you.
And so in truth then and truth.
For what part has your perspective played in the breakdown of communications in this relationship
and so my perspective.
I've I've really approached this relationship from a place of fear and assuming
assuming the worst of this other person actually where that's that's that I've allowed that to stop
me from being honest with her and I fear that being honest will cost her approval.
And what does fear stand for again was False Evidence Appearing Real or something like that.
Yeah yeah.
Where we come turn and make an assumption then just assume and act as if it is true.
Yeah.
So just to get clear here.
So it's actually been your your judgments from from your perspective and my perspective.
And the truth is that you've made judgments of this of the person you've met.
You've assumed the worst thus thus what you brought into the relationship.
You've brought assumptions and judgments into the relationship.
Right assumption and yeah.
And judgments super assumption judgments and you haven't brought truth.
No no I haven't but you and I.
Okay let's just close just go with.
We will look at the reasons why.
Well just look at the facts.
So if we could look at them this other person know it from another person's perspective what is it that
if you were to put yourself in their shoes and just look at the relationship from their perspective
how do you think they are how do you see that they will have experienced you and the and the relationship
over the last however many years how have they actually experienced your
I reckon that
the they don't know where they stand with me.
No of experienced because they've experienced me as withdrawn from the relationship.
So can I ask you Did you just change your perspective here a little bit rather than rather than assume.
I just see if you can put yourself in this other person's shoes okay put yourself in the other person's
shoes to intellectualize this.
All right.
Don't do.
Guess this one away.
Put yourself in the person's shoes and look in actuality how this other person will have experienced
you know what you think.
This is how they have actually experienced you.
In truth.
See your thoughts now are completely irrelevant
so closed.
So this person has experienced you as being closed here which means
which means there hitting a brick wall at times where they initiate and I don't follow through.
And just to be clear just to get crystal clear.
How specifically are the home experience and who's being closed.
Who.
My lack of effort and wanting to connect.
Wanting to meet up.
And are you close to this other person because you're because you actually love them or are you close
to this person because you've assumed the worst of them.
Am closed because I assume the worst of them.
And from this other person's perspective how might this have felt to them.
Pretty disappointing.
Probably confusing.
If you look through their eyes and actually look at the relationship from their perspective how well
their relationship actually have been for them
confusing I imagine.
I imagine I can see they would be sad about the distance and so the level of intimacy has gone
closeness has gone.
Connection yet kind of gone yet so far is no longer in the relationship.
That used to be years ago.
Remember there's all sorts of reasons when two people aren't grown together they've grown apart.
If two people don't fundamentally trust each other then they're not going to share that which is true
with each other.
So it takes two people to tango.
The purpose of this exercise is just about you looking at this relationship from the other person's
perspective instead of your own it sometimes allows us to be a bit more compassionate and Grace or with
people doesn't it.
Yeah.
It's a tough exercise.
By the way so far for them that familiarity and being able to relate to me that's gone and
an unknown one level of intimacy.
Like we we're never really close in terms of a genuine level of intimacy where we would share openly.
Yeah yeah but in terms of being able to relate or know which I know where each other is that you can
have like we can have like deep intimacy then you can have informal intimacy where you just know you
stand with a person you know you trust each other and those kind of levels of depth you go to with different
people.
Yeah I know some people you really open up with and there's other people that you know you can trust
not to judge you but you wouldn't necessarily trust them to go really really deep with.
Yeah yeah something like that.
Yeah exactly.
I would never although I wouldn't.
Years ago I wouldn't have been aware of that those different levels of intimacy.
But looking back I would never have trusted this other person to really open up and about what you.
For me
interesting.
So if I was to know ask you to take a very very different viewpoint a very different stance so it can
be sometimes quite hard concept you know stepping in and out of a room perspective and into someone
else's Hope who was demonstrated this year of having a conversation and sometimes a few occasions I've
asked you to talk about what the relationship will have been like from this other person's perspective
and you talk about what you think from your perspective what I'm seeing here is it can be very very
difficult to empathetically relate to other people and actually really put ourselves in other people's
shoes.
Yeah yeah yeah yeah.
So this can be quite difficult.
And the reason why I wanted to demonstrate this was because this can also be quite difficult for us
to do as life coaches.
All right.
And I mentioned in the last video that the rule or the position we want to be striving for is one of
complete objectivity.
No this is what I've done my best to model here in this conversation because I'm looking as a as a as
a bystander as an observer looking on.
I'm just simply asking questions to establish that which is true.
So because I'm not emotionally connected or involved in current story I'm Suskind questions to provoke
you and encourage you to consider what the actual truth is.
So in the same way no if you were to kind of imagine yourself a picture yourself as a fly on the wall.
All right.
Yeah right.
And I know you're a very visual person so close your eyes for this one for a second.
Right.
Just picture yourself as a fly on the wall or an observer standing in the corner of the room who's observing
and watching Eunice or the person having an interaction with each other how things how things often
actually are or have been in the last season.
Right.
What's actually going on in this conversation though you're an observer so you are not involved in the
discussion or the interaction.
How do you see both parties being with each other.
Both quite anxious both quite anxious and what are both doing what are both doing and what both do not
doing.
Both are
talking about lots of superficial type things but neither are really talking about or being honest about
how they're actually feeling which is anxious and not sure how they connect with each other or relate
to each other
not being honest about the most important thing that they could both be talking about so they both approach
and the relationship from quite a surface level shallow superficial yet less whilst both actually want
something more than that.
Yeah.
So I'm wondering then what it is that these two people are both choosing choosing connection or disconnection
or what they're choosing choosing disconnect it's the choosing disconnection but what is it they both
want connection.
So they both want connection but yet they both choose and disconnection.
So if you were to offer these two people some guidance.
No it's just open your eyes again.
All right.
If you want to know offer these two people some practical guidance is going to enable them both to actually
start getting what they want.
What guidance would this be for them both to start being honest about how they're feeling and a gap
that's come into the relationship and of why and what needs to be done to cause it.
So both people love each other.
Both people both people take responsibility for that which is true for themselves and then both people
then communicate this truth that they can start potentially rebuilding up a lost trust or intimacy or
connection.
Perhaps was once there.
Yeah at least on our level.
Yeah.
Interesting.
So from a coaching perspective then.
All right.
And on a very practical level how is it that you could choose to start being different.
No.
If you were to take full responsibility for the part that you can play in the process of changing and
being different for this other person starting get more of what you actually want what must change right
away.
I must initiate an honest conversation.
You must initiate an honest conversation because it would be easy to follow the superficial chat to
just continue to get any closer.
Nothing changes.
I'm aware of this.
I don't know if this other person.
They're not back and do something that you can do something about it today.
And responsibility breeds empowerment empowerment.
Fantastic.
All right cool.
Do you see what we've just done here.
All right.
So it wasn't like I wanted to really stage this I wanted to keep this conversation very very real time
and very very natural.
All right to give his eyes as real life and experience as far as what we could do.
This is how a coach and relationship would look like from your coaching based conversation.
Very very conversational.
My I'm remaining completely connected with with Karen but I'm operating from the observer's perspective.
All right.
Just simply looking to establish that which is true.
To provoke Karen to look and take responsibility for the part that she's playing and not getting what
she wants from the relationship but also to help Karen consider the other person's perspective.
And she then stepped into the observer position consider why this other the person's holding back and
not get where they're from where they want from the relationship as well.
So these are the three perceptual positions all right.
And it's not like you have conversations like this all the time and every single coaching relationship
you want but as a life coach it's really really important that you understand that these three positions
exist.
What I would encourage you to do is find someone to have perceptual positions based conversation with
around the more you practice the better you will become.
And when you're engaging in a conversation with someone you're not just coming from your perspective
being right.
Being wrong is having some thoughts having some opinions as you come in from the from the perspective
of really immersing yourself in someone else's shoes to see what they see and hear of what they hear
and feel what they feel from their perspective.
All right.
This process if you like really deems our own perspective completely irrelevant and on factual where
we're just simply acknowledging that the way that we see things most likely is not the way that things
actually are and truthful so calm.
Any feedback that's quite powerful and an exercise like just to remind myself that all that actually
is required is to be honest in this situation.
It's not the worst case scenario inside my mind as is is completely on you know well it's worst case
scenario is like totally
thought and unlikely unlikely.
And that's not what this other person is thinking.
Catastrophes blown out of all proportion yes.
Yes.
And this is what most people do when they become trapped in their own perspectives in life growing and
life is about growing and our ability to acknowledge and appreciate that other people have perspectives
too.
And until we get good looking at life from other people's perspectives we're going to struggle to connect
with other people in a meaningful or intimate way.
Phil stop.
Interesting discussion.
All right thank you very much for being so for being so honest calm.
Listen any additional materials section off this video later are you going to find a work that was put
to put together this can encapsulate in a number of the ideas that were shared through the section of
the course we're going to be wrapping things up for this section anyway in the next video.
But we've touched on the perceptual positions process.
All right give you a bit of a framework for working off.
We've also looked at the seven pillars off relationship as well i.e. the foundations of trust and we've
built the trust equation into that so give me a little bit of fair Hallmark before you move on to the
next video.
Spend 15 20 minutes working through the resource and just really familiarize yourself with the concepts
if you need to put them into practice for someone.
All right.
Right away.
This is how we get permanently better at becoming effective coaches and human beings in life.
So I hope you found this demonstration conversation helpful insightful and we'll look forward to seeing
you again in the next clip.